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	<title>Comments for That Humanist</title>
	<atom:link href="http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com</link>
	<description>About thinking and living</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 22:56:06 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Death to the orangutans! by Clare</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/04/26/death-to-the-orangutans/#comment-29</link>
		<dc:creator>Clare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Apr 2008 22:56:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=9#comment-29</guid>
		<description>I was always a fan of Gerald Durrell too! I&#039;ve only recently starting catching on to the whole Palm Oil and Biofuels issues. It&#039;s another one to look out for when reading labels...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was always a fan of Gerald Durrell too! I&#8217;ve only recently starting catching on to the whole Palm Oil and Biofuels issues. It&#8217;s another one to look out for when reading labels&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on 123 meme by Clare</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/05/123-meme/#comment-24</link>
		<dc:creator>Clare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 22:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=7#comment-24</guid>
		<description>I feel really bad tagging a post which is a post resulting from a previous meme tag by me, but maybe this will be a motivation to get back to posting. Your thoughts are missed...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel really bad tagging a post which is a post resulting from a previous meme tag by me, but maybe this will be a motivation to get back to posting. Your thoughts are missed&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on 123 meme by Daniel</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/05/123-meme/#comment-23</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 15:02:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=7#comment-23</guid>
		<description>If a humanist ceases to post, does he remain a humanist?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If a humanist ceases to post, does he remain a humanist?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Faith Schools by Daniel</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/04/faith-schools/#comment-15</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 14:14:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=6#comment-15</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m wondering, though, about your choice of words. At what point are children ready to really understand evolution. Adults who believe literally in fables worry me - children, not so much.

For example, we teach kids &quot;you can&#039;t take the square root of a negative number.&quot; We don&#039;t explain to kids who are just grasping the idea of the infinite that some infinities are bigger than others but that 5 + infinity is just infinity.  We spend an endless amount of time teaching them to factor quadratic equations when almost all quadratic equations cannot be factored.

We teach many things in school which aren&#039;t true or aren&#039;t complete. So my question isn&#039;t why you and the rest in your religion object to how evolution is not being taught - but why this is the issue that is more important to you than so many others?

Suppose a student understands and &quot;accepts&quot; evolution but finishes high school and never reads another book and can not do any math other than simple arithmetic - that to me is a bigger tragedy (and a more common one) than a student who graduates from high school and is well rounded and understands the arguments in favor of evolution but just doesn&#039;t accept them.

I may not be expressing myself well here - I am not anti-evolution or religious - I just wonder why this is more important than other issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m wondering, though, about your choice of words. At what point are children ready to really understand evolution. Adults who believe literally in fables worry me &#8211; children, not so much.</p>
<p>For example, we teach kids &#8220;you can&#8217;t take the square root of a negative number.&#8221; We don&#8217;t explain to kids who are just grasping the idea of the infinite that some infinities are bigger than others but that 5 + infinity is just infinity.  We spend an endless amount of time teaching them to factor quadratic equations when almost all quadratic equations cannot be factored.</p>
<p>We teach many things in school which aren&#8217;t true or aren&#8217;t complete. So my question isn&#8217;t why you and the rest in your religion object to how evolution is not being taught &#8211; but why this is the issue that is more important to you than so many others?</p>
<p>Suppose a student understands and &#8220;accepts&#8221; evolution but finishes high school and never reads another book and can not do any math other than simple arithmetic &#8211; that to me is a bigger tragedy (and a more common one) than a student who graduates from high school and is well rounded and understands the arguments in favor of evolution but just doesn&#8217;t accept them.</p>
<p>I may not be expressing myself well here &#8211; I am not anti-evolution or religious &#8211; I just wonder why this is more important than other issues.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Faith Schools by Jon</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/04/faith-schools/#comment-14</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 10:11:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=6#comment-14</guid>
		<description>Clare: you are right about the accents of course!  I had never thought of that (duh). 

Daniel: Yes, evolution is being taught, but it is being taught alongside fables from a religious text about creation.  This is what I object to.  Your question strikes at the heart of my discomfort.  

Children are greatly aided in learning to differentiate facts from fiction by their peers and elders.  Here we have authority, the teachers,  intentionally blurring (I believe this is substantiated by the documentaries and curricula I have seen) the difference.  By teaching Noah&#039;s ark and evolution in the same class, both are presented on equal footing.  However, evolution is simply not open to interpretation in the same way that Noah&#039;s ark is.  In other words, the presentation is so skewed that the child will easily end up not accepting it.

Yes, you are right about &quot;I find this&quot; :-)  I was sloppy.  I&#039;ll fix the text!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clare: you are right about the accents of course!  I had never thought of that (duh). </p>
<p>Daniel: Yes, evolution is being taught, but it is being taught alongside fables from a religious text about creation.  This is what I object to.  Your question strikes at the heart of my discomfort.  </p>
<p>Children are greatly aided in learning to differentiate facts from fiction by their peers and elders.  Here we have authority, the teachers,  intentionally blurring (I believe this is substantiated by the documentaries and curricula I have seen) the difference.  By teaching Noah&#8217;s ark and evolution in the same class, both are presented on equal footing.  However, evolution is simply not open to interpretation in the same way that Noah&#8217;s ark is.  In other words, the presentation is so skewed that the child will easily end up not accepting it.</p>
<p>Yes, you are right about &#8220;I find this&#8221; <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/face-smile.png' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />   I was sloppy.  I&#8217;ll fix the text!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Faith Schools by Daniel</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/04/faith-schools/#comment-13</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 00:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=6#comment-13</guid>
		<description>I was very struck by the phrase &quot;Schools where children are taught evolution, but where most students don’t end up &#039;accepting it&#039;.&quot;

We are taught many things in school that are subject to interpretation - many of these are taught as facts. How do we separate those from the things that are true. 

Even outside of school - a great deal of Americans believe that we were right to go into Iraq because they attacked us on 9/11. In the scheme of things we accept and don&#039;t accept - why does evolution bother you than many of the other things a child doesn&#039;t accept.

It sounds as if evolution is being taught in these schools. If you take a child with a very religious home life and teach them evolution in a heterogeneous public school - is this child any more likely to &quot;accept&quot; it. 

Finally, when you say &quot;Many would find this repugnant, immoral, and an abuse of authority.&quot; do you mean to say &quot;I find this ...&quot;

D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was very struck by the phrase &#8220;Schools where children are taught evolution, but where most students don’t end up &#8216;accepting it&#8217;.&#8221;</p>
<p>We are taught many things in school that are subject to interpretation &#8211; many of these are taught as facts. How do we separate those from the things that are true. </p>
<p>Even outside of school &#8211; a great deal of Americans believe that we were right to go into Iraq because they attacked us on 9/11. In the scheme of things we accept and don&#8217;t accept &#8211; why does evolution bother you than many of the other things a child doesn&#8217;t accept.</p>
<p>It sounds as if evolution is being taught in these schools. If you take a child with a very religious home life and teach them evolution in a heterogeneous public school &#8211; is this child any more likely to &#8220;accept&#8221; it. </p>
<p>Finally, when you say &#8220;Many would find this repugnant, immoral, and an abuse of authority.&#8221; do you mean to say &#8220;I find this &#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>D</p>
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		<title>Comment on Faith Schools by Clare</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/04/faith-schools/#comment-12</link>
		<dc:creator>Clare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2008 00:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=6#comment-12</guid>
		<description>Also... tag!

The 123 Rules:

1. Pick up the book nearest you with at least 123 pages. (No cheating!)
2. Turn to page 123.
3. Count the first five sentences.
4. Post the next three sentences.
5. Tag five other bloggers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also&#8230; tag!</p>
<p>The 123 Rules:</p>
<p>1. Pick up the book nearest you with at least 123 pages. (No cheating!)<br />
2. Turn to page 123.<br />
3. Count the first five sentences.<br />
4. Post the next three sentences.<br />
5. Tag five other bloggers.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Faith Schools by Clare</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/02/04/faith-schools/#comment-11</link>
		<dc:creator>Clare</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Feb 2008 17:26:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/?p=6#comment-11</guid>
		<description>Arguably, there are plenty of schools in London where the pupils don&#039;t sound like Londoners (e.g. private schools) so I wouldn&#039;t worry too much about accents. However, the idea that faith schools may be exempt from the standard educational regulation I find absolutely abhorrent and unacceptable. Every child in the UK should be allowed access to a decent education regardless of the beliefs of their family or carers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Arguably, there are plenty of schools in London where the pupils don&#8217;t sound like Londoners (e.g. private schools) so I wouldn&#8217;t worry too much about accents. However, the idea that faith schools may be exempt from the standard educational regulation I find absolutely abhorrent and unacceptable. Every child in the UK should be allowed access to a decent education regardless of the beliefs of their family or carers.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Root of All Morality? by Jon Mountjoy</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/01/20/the-root-of-all-morality/#comment-10</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Mountjoy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jan 2008 14:37:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/01/20/the-root-of-all-morality/#comment-10</guid>
		<description>Hi Daniel

I guess I wasn&#039;t clear enough, but this is really getting to &quot;doing the right thing when no one is looking.&quot; What makes people do good?  Some believe it&#039;s authority from a religious text, while others believe it&#039;s authority from people, and an innate sense of morality.

In a sense I&#039;m trying to explore what makes us do good when no one is watching. You are spot on about the concept of principles.  The current research into morality makes the difference between principles and intuitions.  We often have intuitions about moral actions without recourse to some set of principles.  Or vice versa.  Interesting things happen when our principles and our intuitions don&#039;t coincide on the same action.

I&#039;m new to this - I hope future blog posts will look at some practical aspects of morality too.  The theory is no good without it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Daniel</p>
<p>I guess I wasn&#8217;t clear enough, but this is really getting to &#8220;doing the right thing when no one is looking.&#8221; What makes people do good?  Some believe it&#8217;s authority from a religious text, while others believe it&#8217;s authority from people, and an innate sense of morality.</p>
<p>In a sense I&#8217;m trying to explore what makes us do good when no one is watching. You are spot on about the concept of principles.  The current research into morality makes the difference between principles and intuitions.  We often have intuitions about moral actions without recourse to some set of principles.  Or vice versa.  Interesting things happen when our principles and our intuitions don&#8217;t coincide on the same action.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m new to this &#8211; I hope future blog posts will look at some practical aspects of morality too.  The theory is no good without it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Root of All Morality? by Daniel</title>
		<link>http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/01/20/the-root-of-all-morality/#comment-9</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2008 13:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thathumanist.wordpress.com/2008/01/20/the-root-of-all-morality/#comment-9</guid>
		<description>This is a different notion of morality than I would have expected here. I&#039;ve heard that morality is doing the right thing when no one is looking. What worries me in the definition are the &quot;concerned with&quot;s. Does someone who is moral wrestle with the issues of (someone&#039;s notion of) right vs. wrong and choose when they can what is right? Or are they concerned with the principles of ...

This latter phrasing worries me because you could be moral and be concerned with such principles but behave quite badly. The second &quot;concerned with&quot; strikes me the same way.

So your definition of morals implies nothing about action or behavior. Perhaps that is right - but it is too academic for my tastes.

Finally, I think that most people think that they are doing mostly the right thing. We have a huge capacity for justifying much of what we do. I would hate for this to be classified under &quot;moral&quot; behavior.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a different notion of morality than I would have expected here. I&#8217;ve heard that morality is doing the right thing when no one is looking. What worries me in the definition are the &#8220;concerned with&#8221;s. Does someone who is moral wrestle with the issues of (someone&#8217;s notion of) right vs. wrong and choose when they can what is right? Or are they concerned with the principles of &#8230;</p>
<p>This latter phrasing worries me because you could be moral and be concerned with such principles but behave quite badly. The second &#8220;concerned with&#8221; strikes me the same way.</p>
<p>So your definition of morals implies nothing about action or behavior. Perhaps that is right &#8211; but it is too academic for my tastes.</p>
<p>Finally, I think that most people think that they are doing mostly the right thing. We have a huge capacity for justifying much of what we do. I would hate for this to be classified under &#8220;moral&#8221; behavior.</p>
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